Posts by Half banana

18

My thoughts on Church shootings..

by DATA-DOG in

disclaimer: i do not approve or condone any acts of violence that result in the deaths of innocent persons.. alright.. let me just say that i have no idea what motivated the latest mass shooting, nor do i condone those actions.

i am, however, beginning to understand why some individuals may feel that violence is their only choice, although i do not approve of that choice.. when i read topics on this forum that concern religion and legalism, topics that drone on and on, getting nowhere, i feel extremely frustrated.

yes, religions are given certain freedoms, but many are obviously going beyond the spirit that motivated the separation of church and state.

Half banana

DD, I'm talking off the cuff too but surely the shootings in question have little to do with religion, no more than a massacre at a school is to do with education. Isn't it about the psychopath who sees certain groups as so abhorrent to him or so valueless that he imagines he will feel better for killing some of them. It's about the accessibility of dangerous weapons by people with deranged minds.

The target for the rest of us must be to recognize those potentially vulnerable to such behaviour and have some social systems in place to help them. Easier said than done.

I can't help thinking how the JW org is all about being an outsider and fervently looking forward to "the death of the opposers" which is frankly in the same vein as these maniacs who do kill indiscriminately.

5

Astro-theology and dates concerning Jesus the moon god?

by Crazyguy in

i have done a lot of research over the years in to jesus and how he related to other older gods and astro-theology.

many who have looked in to this before me have stated that jesus is a retelling of a son god.

they talk about horus and quote scriptures where jesus is alluded to being the sun of god as much as the son of god.

Half banana

I don't think his death age signified anything in particular but the absence of a biography of Jesus between the age of twelve to thirty, if memory serves right was a direct parallel with Horus myth.

When looking at the mythos behind a story it is probably best to know what the key signifiers were in the first place. To fulfill solar myth the hero's death had to be at the time of "the cross" i.e. when the Sun's path (the ecliptic) crosses the equator at the spring equinox in the northern hemisphere.

In the matter of Sun gods and their offspring the moon does not usually figure and neither does thirty three years. The moon gods were usually feminine-- although in the Levant there were many exceptions including Yahweh who was a Canaanite male moon god, with his regular curved horns relating to the crescent Moon. The other element for the Moon would be its shorter periodicity not relating to the whole astronomical cycle of the solar year which would be the Sun god's rightful period.

Another reason to exclude the Moon as a type for JC was that the son of the Sun god was "the exact representation of his very being". How perfectly true this was, as each morning it was witnessed by the ancients who saw in a glorious winter sunrise over the Nile, the rising Sun god and his perfect reflection in the water below.

The fact that the Sun 'dies' for three and a half days I suggest is applied as a literary device to simply signify that the hero character who goes through this process (Odysseus and JC etc) was a mighty god like person. He is not required to do it as the same time as the actual Sun does.

41

October 31, 2017 TO ALL CONGREGATIONS Re: New Visitor Exhibit at Bethel (UK)

by wifibandit in

october 31, 2017 to all congregations re: new visitor exhibit at bethel.

Half banana

Thanx Dark

41

October 31, 2017 TO ALL CONGREGATIONS Re: New Visitor Exhibit at Bethel (UK)

by wifibandit in

october 31, 2017 to all congregations re: new visitor exhibit at bethel.

Half banana

It is my guess that Chelmsford was purchased by IBSA as a separate entity of the WT empire. Perhaps there are legal or financial benefits for retaining IBSA wealth here in the UK which would be lost if all the millions went to New York. Chelmsford is just another property investment and much bigger than they need.

How many JWs in UK, 160,000 and reducing? What justifies millions being spent for their 'spiritual benefit' at Chelmsford? JWs after all are able to keep contact with the seven dwarfs electronically!

IBSA should be dissolved and its wealth should be returned to those who contributed to it or in the spirit of Christianity; charitably given to the needy.

59

What can the leadership at Watchtower do to turn things around?

by UnshackleTheChains in

let's play devils advocate here.. put yourself in the governing body's shoes.

they are well aware of all the issues they are facing.

they know their numbers (they 'do the math' as they say in the us).

Half banana

I am in agreement Van.

What can they do?

Come clean and admit to the world that they have always been wrong in virtually everything they have ever said, done, published or broadcast.

Solemnly declare they have no special relationship with any divinity and that their religion is a failure as a prophetic institution and that they have perpetuated a fraud.

They can dissolve all arms of their worldly empire and shut up shop.

They can apologise to those who they have taken advantage of or who have suffered loss of lives, loss of self esteem, family closeness, earning capacity et cetera because of their teachings-- and return WT wealth back to their supporters and contributors in part compensation.

59

A Little Direction Please

by Brian J in

i'm an active elder, cobe, just got home from the meeting where i handled the treasures part and concluded by announcing a friend of mine has been d/f,.....blah blah blah...and over the last year have woken up.

i simply cannot spill my guts to my wife and children as it would be family suicide.

i have zero desire to bash, spread my feelings, or become an "apostate".

Half banana

Brian I first admit that I failed when I was in your position but that does mean that I have had the chance to analyse what went wrong. In my case without criticising the org, just by stopping going to the meetings and saying that I didn't believe it anymore was enough for my wife to brand me as a devil.

In retrospect I can see that the effect on my wife was taken to be an attack on her sense of security. It undermined her status as wife and mother and at the same time it challenged her emotional dependance on her Watchtower delusion and the social circle within the congregation.

To suddenly stop being a JW is a shocking and powerful event for the believing spouse. In my case my wife went in the direction of becoming a super zealous JW blindly ignoring all other considerations. This had serious repercussions on the whole family and especially on my young children.

In other words; don't do what I did! I suggest you remember that your wife wants security and consideration and not have the rug pulled from under her feet. So the advice already given to take it very slowly is a must.

I guess that your wife needs the experience of being given a new vision of an honest and good life without dependence on flimsy promises of paradise before she is exposed to the faults of the JW mind-set. Criticism of the religion only arouses entrenchment.

As you loosen the ties with JWdom you can increase your time with your wife and family instead.

All the best to you as you embark on your new direction in life, remember we are with you and do keep posting!

38

October 31, 2017 TO SELECTED BOEs IN THE US BRANCH TERRITORY Re: Discontinuation of the Funds-on-Deposit Arrangement

by wifibandit in

october 31, 2017 to selected bodies of elders in the united states branch territory re: discontinuation of the funds-on-deposit arrangement.

Half banana

As the masked highwayman said pointing both of his cocked pistols, "Stand and deliver".

59

What can the leadership at Watchtower do to turn things around?

by UnshackleTheChains in

let's play devils advocate here.. put yourself in the governing body's shoes.

they are well aware of all the issues they are facing.

they know their numbers (they 'do the math' as they say in the us).

Half banana

I would never recommend the GB take any action as they are beyond the pale of human decency to begin with. Why try to improve an organisation which uses social torture, religious threats and emotional abuse to get its own way? It should be shut down not encouraged.

The leaders of the JW organisation are only out for themselves!

When have they ever seriously considered the genuine, heartfelt welfare of anyone? The best they can do for someone afflicted by the errors of the organisation is to resort to reading a scripture to them. Cheap, unfeeling and pathetic for a multi billion Dollar corporation.

The JW org is a disgraceful and fraudulent purveyor of false hope which stamps on individual development, it endorses a slave mentality and produces an army of depressed followers with no ambition and low self esteem.

The irony is that the only thing which gives them the sense of authority are the things which hurt their flock the most; especially shunning of family members, responding to the life or death decree to not take a blood transfusion, to not have higher education and therefore to suffer low grade employment and a dependant attitude.

These requirements are the tools of GB power-- to relinquish these demands would be to lose control. It is a sick religion.

7

Who did new testament writers think Jesus was ?

by Steel in

i have been reading this book called " the two powers in heaven " .. the readers digest version is basically there was a first century belief of kind of a dual god system in the old testament.

god is invisible and yet he appears at the " word of the lord " or " the angel of the lord ".

basically any time god was visible and dealing with humans in a touchable , see able manner , it was though to be christ.

Half banana

I think it is a mistake to imagine that there is a coherent message in either the OT or Greek scriptures. The texts are eclectic and use folk tales, borrowed rituals and stories and most certainly borrowed ideas.

Christianity from its start was a cult competing with other messianic cults and based on the pagan temple worship and its ritualised hope for salvation. Clear evidence for this connection is seen in Christianity using the same functionaries of bishops, presbyters and deacons etc as did the pagans. (It was only after Rome dominated and enforced Christian belief in a fusion of Catholic dogma that the earlier paganism was strictly proscribed).

Christianity evolved from paganism. The nature of the NT texts reflect the nature of seeking converts and avoiding the 'wrong type' of cult teachings on penalty as Paul said, of being "mentally diseased", it was about a scramble for prime position in the cult marketplace.

The first century christ story was not the same as the fourth century Roman fusion christ story. Consequently at the root of the choice of texts which are included in the NT canon are those which satisfy the cultural longings of the disparate groups of would be believers. Hence 1Cor 10;1 was used so as to resonate with Jews and be meaningful to them-- but not only Jews, the text also had to appeal to followers of Mithra, the saviour Dionysus and Orphic cults amongst others. It had to fuse polytheism with monotheism and bring the mainspring beliefs of each religion into an accommodation of credible acceptance to all. It was never a perfect fusion it always bore ambiguities.

At this distance in time from the writings, we should be looking at the historicity and sociological basis for these beliefs. To believe them or attempt to put any of it into practice is surely madness.

19

Alternative witnessing

by Zyron in

jw
friends

those of us still attending meeting are actively encouraged to use out tablets or smartphones to direct people to jw.org.

how about, after doing the standard presentation casually say to householder, you can also look at this forum to read of experiences of life as a jw as well as the official version?.

obviously you need to be working by yourself or with a pimo jw..

Half banana

You little devil Zyron! but what a good idea.

It would probably be best for those rare individuals who have been taking the Watchtower bait like Bible studies or someone who is actually showing an interest.